By Kevin Mahadeo in
Anime, Daily Lists
Monday, Feb. 22 2010 @ 8:02AM
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As Ichigo grew increasingly more dull and boring -- the only character worse than him being his love interest Orihime, whose sole purpose is to say "Kurosaki-kun" over and over again as her only line of dialogue -- it quickly became apparent how far more awesome and interesting the characters around him were. Whether through complex characterization, a certain air of mystery or by simply being just that damn badass, the members of this list display precisely how kickass they are and how comparatively lame Ichigo really is. 10) Genryusai Shigekuni Yamamoto
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9) Grimmjow Jaegerjaquez
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8) Kenpachi Zaraki
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7) Sosuke Aizen
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6) Gin Ichimaru
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5) Shunsui Kyoraku
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4) Byakuya Kuchiki
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3) Yoruichi Shihoin
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2) Kisuke Urahara
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1) Isshin Kurosaki
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123 comments
Comments
SafetyDance101 said:
Meh. While I agree that these characters are all more interesting than Ichigo and Orihime, very few of them rise above screaming manga/anime cliches, especially the (imo) highly overrated berserker Kenpachi and the gary-sue Byakuya. But given that this is an action consumed Shounen that fell into the lowest common denominator spiral after tasting mainstream success, I know I shouldn't expect Shakespeare.
Chad replied to SafetyDance101:
Gin was my favorite character from the first time he appeared. His sadistic, antagonizing, playful, and over the top polite mannerisms make him the epitome of badass in a sea of badassedry so thick that it has body hair.
Ichigo was a great character until the hueco mundo arc. In soul society, he just kept digging deeper and deeper into potential he has always had, and he actually lost or drew with every win he was given. Come hueco mundo, he is fighting enemies several levels above him (Hitsugaya is just as bad) and still winning for no reason other than, "because the author says so." It might make sense when Ichigo goes full on berserker hollow and wins (especially his best and most awesome transformation against Ulquira... I imagine many a female fan had an orgasm at the sight of long haired, torn pimp suit Ichigo), but he has no right beating enemies well beyond him without his hollow taking over (Grimjow got shafted).
Ichigo's hollow and Zangetsu (same thing, supposedly) are both far more interesting characters than Ichigo, and if he's ever going to return to being a more awesome character than the supporting cast, he needs to start working with one or become the other.
vinz replied to SafetyDance101:
It's kind of surprising they didn't mention what a complete dick Byakuya is actually. In his misguided attempts to remove his sister from combat, he winds up pulling as much dickery as Gin, but minus the suave personality. Also, Kurama was superior.
Grimmjow kinda sucks, tragic, pfah, Seiji from Hokuto no Ken was the same guy with an actually tragic backstory, training from hell care of his Heihachi clone dad, and a far deeper understanding and embrace of his own bloodlust.
Did you notice Urahara is somewhat responsible for everything that happened? Pretty funny, huh? Violinist of Hameln did that too.
I love the series for being a mishmash of older, better series, but I hate it for being completely ADD with its story, and misusing the best characters. It's easy to be more interesting than Ichigo when he disappears for several months at a frickin' time! Perhaps he needs to train further with Yoruichi to truly learn how to be memorable, since she's been gone even LONGER! (You forgot to mention Yoruichi's other big selling point...Lesbian student hypercrush! It's like if Orihime was an action-girl captain and Tatsuki was the Lieutenant.)
On that note, Orihime pisses me off for having instant-revive powers and never using them. Exactly why are 80% of the cast dead with her around anyway? YOU RETARD!
CTrees said:
You've hit, briefly, on what's bothering me the most about Bleach right now. They're in a massive battle with Aizen and his remaining forces (so, now just with Aizen), and the good guys are dropping like flies. The fate of essentially all three worlds is at stake. And yet, Isshin, Urahara, and the Captain Commander all have yet to step up to Aizen (Capt. Comm. did take out a couple random mooks, but that's it thus far). I can't recall as to Isshin, but the other two are known to be ridiculously powerful, even though we've yet to see their Bankais, and yet... where are they? Even if they show up later, it's going to leave the question of why they let all those other people die.
It just bugs me.
SafetyDance101 replied to CTrees:
To be fair, Kubo needed to compensate for the piss poor handling of the Espadas. When they were first introduced, they were built up as the hollow/arrancar answer to the Gotei 13 and a true existential threat to SS, but they were all slaughtered without causing a single casualty, meaning that the very few antagonists remaining had to push the whole protagonist army to the brink by themselves or else the manga would end without a significant conflict. In fact, IIRC the sum total of the damage the Espada inflicted was 2 characters losing an arm each. By the time Aizen got off his ass, and after he killed Tousen, it was about 16 on 3 counting Ichigo and the Vizards, excluding Hiori and Hacchi, with all those protagonists practically fresh as daisies. It sucks the someone like Shunshei or Shinji had to go down without showing their full power, and it's stupid as hell that Yamma hasn't seriously stepped in by now, but at least now it's down to 5 on 3 (counting Omaeda and Yamma's vice) in FKT, hopefully meaning that period of one side completely dominating the other before being completely dominated themselves is over.
Mindela said:
Add this to Aizen's reasons for being awesome/interesting
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheThirtySixStratagems
THE PR0F3550R said:
"'Ichigo always managed to win because 'he has to.'"
Come on Kevin, this really sucks. You're describing just about 99% of manga/anime/comics/cartoons in existence. I really don't see your argument here. I've never seen Bleach, but if your argument is that Ichigo sucks because he has to win then you are a manga/anime noob.
This has got to be one of the weakest "Top/Best/Worst Lists" I've read on this site. Are you going to tell me Yugi Mutoh is boring because he has to win? Is Son Goku boring because he has to win? Is Usagi Tsukino boring because she has to win? Is Gene Starwind boring because he has to win? Is Batman boring because he has to win? Is Spider-man boring because he has to win? Is Luke Skywalker boring because he has to win?
The truth is that Bleach must just be a shitty manga/anime if the main character cannot hold the audience's attention and thus the waning fans begin to look into other characters for fun or interest. This is no different than Warsies who want to suck Boba Fett's dick or Pott-Heads love for Sirius Black.
BLEACH IS SHIT AND THIS LIST FAILS!
Joe_Mello replied to THE PR0F3550R:
I see your point, but most of the people you listed had some personality. Ichigo has pretty much seemed to have lost all of his during Soul Society. He's no longer the reluctant wise-ass Reaper he once was; he's the cardboard cutout of a white knight whose sole motivation now is to rescue the damsel in distress and slay the dragon.
THE PR0F3550R replied to Joe_Mello:
Yeah, but if he's "the cardboard cutout of a white knight whose sole motivation now is to rescue the damsel in distress and slay the dragon" that alone cannot make him shitty. I mean than guys like Superman, Underdog, Captain America, King Arthur, Popeye, Optimus Prime and most archetypal heroes would just suck ass, right? I mean you could say that Ichigo is the more boring archetypal hero like Duke from G.I. Joe or Ken Washio from Gatchaman and yet we root for those guys.
To me it just seems that Kevin Mahadeo's list has less to do with Ichigo being boring and more to do with a manga/anime series that has run out of steam and needs to be put to sleep before it continues to get worse. Reminds me of Heroes in that regard.
The Hero Archetype must exist because that's who the audience can relate to. If a series fails to figure out how to make their hero grow then the series fails. The only other manga/anime that I see seems similar to Bleach failure is Ikkitōsen where Hakufu the main character drew me into the series with her carefree attitude got pushed aside for weirder more eccentric characters with confusing motivations and sick desires. The only thing it has going for it is plenty of T&A, but that's about it.
rickicker replied to THE PR0F3550R:
i agree with you, professor! might be hard for animenerds to swallow, but anime DOES share the same problems as western shows who's run is way past its due. why can't anybody just let this dying dog die in peace? man!
THE PR0F3550R replied to rickicker:
LOL! I was a huge anime nerd and I still have a soft spot for an anime series that grabs my attention. Maybe I'm getting too old, but anime doesn't enthrall me as much as it once did. Still I know crap when I see it and based on this list and many of the comments here it seems that Bleach (Blech!) has run its course and is now pure suckage and unfortunately the titular character is the scapegoat for this crapfest.
Joe_Mello replied to THE PR0F3550R:
Again, it's all about the person wielding the gun/sword. Ichigo lacks the personality or intellect to be an interesting or endearing character. Granted, this is not an isolated incident within the series and having a personality does not automatically make you interesting (eg Rangiku)
There are plenty of narratives out there where the supporting cast is more interesting than the lead.
emerson999 replied to THE PR0F3550R:
Superman, Underdog, Captain America, King Arthur, Popeye, Optimus Prime and Duke do all kind of suck. At least to the extent that they're dull and don't hold my attention.
THE PR0F3550R replied to emerson999:
Okay and yet people are bothered and cry when Superman, Captain America, and Optimus Prime died. They may be the archetypal heroes, but we care for them and we want them to win. They have interesting foes and allies that keep you into their stories, but you care about them and what they stand for. The stories and universes they come from are rich enough to make us like the hero.
To me it goes back to the main issue with Bleach, it's a bad manga/anime. It's so bad that the flaws are being exposed and the one major flaw is the archetypal hero that doesn't stand for anything and has no purpose other than to be the hero. This is a series that needs to die.
Look at Heroes for similar problems. Peter is supposed to be the archetypal hero, but he's such a douche-bag and full of angst that the audience cannot get behind him. Many of us would have loved to see Hiro and Ando be the dynamic duo, but they are regulated to being the comic relief and even the show ruined that. No body really wants Claire to be the lead because she can't act.
Now sometimes anime/cartoons throw us a curve ball and give us the Anti-Hero or the Dark Knight that does attract a different fan base. For those series it makes sense. I'm talking about multi-dimensional guys/gals like Spike Spiegal, Roger Smith, Gene Starwind, Lina Inverse, Wolverine, etc. whose motivations are never fully clear. But Bleach is not that kind of series and as such needs to succeed on the Hero Archetype structure which it is clearly failing with.
vinz replied to emerson999:
King Arthur cheated on his wife, drove her into the arms of one of his most trusted knights with accusations of HER infidelity (which she never did), cheated on her with his SISTER of all people, and then had to deal with Bro-son raising an army against him, then he was either slain by Bro-son Mordred or they each killed one another, bringing his utopia to an end. And then there's the circumstances behind his birth involving even MORE cheating through the use of magic. This is boring? Better not read any Josei mangas then. And that's all without even getting into the insane Grail quest.
Cap'n America is pretty interesting when he isn't fighting supervillains btw. As a staunch Constitutionalist who follows the 'founders' to the letter, he winds up having a crapton of conflict with Jesusfreaks and libtards equally. If only Civil War had been written by someone like Grant or Neil you would have really seen some interestin' political angles.
The Man With Two Brains replied to THE PR0F3550R:
Actually, people like Captain America and Superman are interesting because their personality still shines through and their morals are challenged and such. THAT is what makes an interesting character. Also, Captain America doesn't always win, and when he does, it's not always cleanly or without a LOT of assistance.
Adam E. replied to THE PR0F3550R:
Like someone else said, those archetypal heroes you mentioned are, in fact, just as boring as Ichigo.
Madame Red replied to THE PR0F3550R:
You just said that you've never seen it but it sucks...
Dude, Stop complaining about shows you don't watch.
vinz replied to THE PR0F3550R:
Usagi IS boring, but not because she has to win. It's because she's a whiny baby I would personally choke the life out of were she a real person. The fact she eats so much screentime (and spends so much eating) makes me wonder WTF the male villains are on to find her attractive in the least. I was rooting in the first season where Mars takes over to be real, though I knew it couldn't be.
Far more enraging on this same trail however, was the first episode of Diamond/Pearl, in which I thought Dawn would be the new hero and they would break the mold of previous series, but no here comes that assmunch who can't fight Ash to steal the show once again. It took me but one episode to fall in love with Dawn, and ten seconds at the very end to punch my fucking TV off its stand.
Azure said:
Meh.
I agree that these are all CERTAINLY more interesting than Ichigo or Orihime, but there are so many characters in Bleach... it's hard to narrow them down to 10, I'd think.
Even though they ultimately failed (and failed hard), a lot more of the Espada were interesting. Yammy? Espada #0? That was ridiculous, probably a troll, but really really... interesting. Stark and Lilinette (...if we changed the spellings when those were officially romanized, I don't remember and don't care) are the same person! Whaaaat? And guns, guns. Stark brings a gun to a sword fight~
And, of course, there's a lot of random, useless, but interesting people off in the margins.
I'm just glad that Hitsugaya was deemed unworthy of this list. I hate that guy.
J.H. said:
I am a subscriber to the theory that Zaraki has always had his Zanpakto manifested and he just never knew it. I honestly believe that Yachiru is the physical manifesation and her presence is so strong that others beside Zaraki see her in semi-released state.
Mind you, it is only a theory. I actually gave up on Bleach after the Soul Society arc as it just got to damn boring...
Hobbcore replied to J.H.:
Strangely enough I always thought the same thing.
Yachiru once described her past before meeting with Kenpachi, she might be an actual human because she (seem to) existed before him come along. Then again, we don't really know how a sword spirit manifests, and it isn't like Kenphachi has the knowledge to recognize it either. It is also possible that she was another person's sword before, and she didn't realize that she is the sword's consciousness.
Garyx said:
I still think Aizen should be higher, but generally I agree with this list.
And, yeah, Ichigo´s father is a million times better than his own dumb son.
yamieridani said:
Cute list...'cept I quit watching when Bleach stopped in the middle of rescuing Orihime for some fluff arc. What have I missed? Should I bother trying to catch up?
Azure replied to yamieridani:
It started to get interesting again a few weeks ago, when the strong people started to... GET SERIOUS.
Of course, it's still filled with trolling and hacked abilities, but...
It's kinda fun that way.
J22 said:
Bleach has gone downhill ever since the SS arc. Ichigo used to be a badass - in the anime taking out like 4 vice-captains in a second without his sword gave me chills. The only reason I still read it is for the characters (mostly Shunsui)
Jeppe said:
The problem with Ichigo and Bleach is that there is no real explanation why he always ends up winning. His future opponent sends Ichigo flying 100 metres into a wall with a flick of a finger then one week later Ichigo can battle him and somehow even in the middle of the battle he just gets stronger and stronger. Its absurd and has really silly in the series.
rickicker replied to Jeppe:
check out tvtropes.org. i think they summed it up nicely there. but if you can't be bothered to do that, then here it is: LEVEL. UP.
SERIOUSLY!! he gets beaten up to by an inch of his life, and then DING!! o HAY, i leveled up! and check out these new cool moves i got!
in fact, i can go as far as saying this is how EVERYBODY in bleach won their fights! i believe we have seen this before *cough*dragonballz*cough*
demoncat said:
i kind of expected Kenpachie or Urahara at number one. though given how Itchigo comes off always using brawn and rushing in with out thinking any character would be worthy of this list.
Karma said:
....Bleach?
You're talking about... Bleach, now?
You know what? No. Just no.
I've been extremely critical of this blog for a long time now. More like "extremely, abrasively, and insultingly harsh on both Rob and his commentary on virtually everything."
But... is this how far we've truly fallen? Talking about.... *spit* fucking... BLEACH now?
One of the worst, most vapidly, stink-ridden, irreprochable, sickeningly abysmal pieces of garbage ever shat out of Japan's collectively foul-smelling vagina like a bloody, man-eating queef from the bowels of hell, itself?
Fucking BLEACH?! Yeahno. That's the last straw, for me.
I've been coming here for a while and admittedly I rarely ever have anything positive to say... but this? THIS?? THIS????
I promised myself that the day an article here was EVER... EVER devoted to either *spit* Naruto or *spit* Bleach, this place, for all of the rotten things i've had to say about both TR, and Rob both... that I would not be able to fucking stand it, it's presence or my affronted sense of human dignity any longer.
That day has come.
Of course, I know none of you shit-lickers will care that i'm gone. Actually you'll all probably be overjoyed that you won't see my comments here anymore, despite the fact that I'm automatically better than just about everyone here on princible of sense and taste alone, but I swear to fucking god. Bleach? Eww.
Fuck this shit. I can put up with Rob's incessent stupidity and acting like he has any logical basis for more than half of his half-assed posts when he doesn't.... sure.
I can even put up with most of the readers here either being cocksniffing sycophants, or jawjacking yes-men to a man who doesn't know what a Smurf looks like or his best reason for hating Zelda 2 being little more than "ew, a sidescroller!"
But what I can't abide by anymore is an article that actually has the pomposity, the presumption, the impertenant, impudent, blashphemous indignity to presume on the basest of levels that Bleach or Naruto or anything of it's kind, type, or level is anything beyond mere trash undeserving of a mention at the slighrst.
That I can't abide. Man, fuck this place. Fuck it good. Fuck it throughly. Fuck it like a blind date with Tiger Woods behind a wal-mart dumpster. In the immortal words of Popeye the Sailorman: "I've had all I can stands, and I can't stands no more."
I'm out.
K replied to Karma:
Dude, take a pill and go on your merry way. Pat yourself on the back for being a hateful douche, and move on. I would tell you to grow up, but people like you never listen to anyone. Good riddance.
Wonder Pigeon replied to Karma:
Heh heh heh
CTrees replied to Karma:
Right, no one cares. "Actually you'll all probably be overjoyed that you won't see my comments here anymore?" Maybe if you were, as they say, the best of the best. Maybe even if we had any clue who the hell you were, but I say this in all honesty - no one cares.
Allison replied to Karma:
Rob didn't write this article.
Heh, that was pretty funny. I'm not a Bleach watcher at all, never seen one episode and I don't care, but I still looked at this thread for the comments, and what do you know? Win! I love nerd rage, it's so much fun to read.
Lithroe replied to Karma:
Self banning? Can we enforce this?
Adam VM replied to Karma:
Only on the internet will people go to places they hate to read shit they don't like, and act like they're doing someone a favor.
Mak replied to Adam VM:
Win.
Anonymous replied to Karma:
^/ragequit
NotAFagUnlikeKarma replied to Karma:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
karmapolice aka tvtastegood replied to Karma:
*sneezes* alergic*sneezes* to*sneezes* bullshit*sneezes*
Congrats on kicking yourself out you should be proud you have attained the official rank of troll you live under bridges scare kids and eat squirrels. You will be missed only for the fact that I won't be constantly reminded that the internet is overrun by useless people.
Adam E. replied to Karma:
Yes, please leave and whine somewhere else.
Mount_Prion replied to Karma:
Who are you? I mean, were you?
emi replied to Karma:
tl;dr version:
BAAAAWWWW BAAAAAAAAAAW BAAAAWWWW
Honestly, I barely made it through the second volume of Bleach, let alone the anime. But come the fuck on, I love this blog because of its variety.
Glad to see you leave.
rickicker replied to Karma:
how many people here are willing to bet that he's going to come back with a different ID and pull a "defend my buddy Karma" deal?
akiratrooper replied to rickicker:
$20 bet for a sockpuppet named "Not Karma"
K said:
Excellent list!
Robobros said:
Really? Yamamoto made this list? Any level of interest one could have in the guy is instantly nixed when you realize that for someone who's been around for at least several hundred years and power that is supposedly unmatched by any other Shinigami...the guy is the most idiotic leader ever. Whether it's cannon, filler, or a movie he always makes the same mistake. Everything occurs under his nose, still doesn't ever trust Ichigo which screws him, and as stated allows things to drag on for no apparent reason when he could burn everything to ash. And Aizen should be removed considering he has the most BS power ever. Really? You see my sword once and it has a hold on you...FOREVER. On top of being more powerful than anyone for no reason. Personally I think Yachiru deserved to be on this list as well as others who have gotten almost 0 screentime (Yamamoto's Vice Captain?). They'd be more interesting for the sheer fact that hey they're there but are never used. Bleach used to be great but after SS it became total fail.
El Oso said:
Aizen takes the cake for the quickest transformation from nerdy goody-two-shoes to an evil, sexy man beast. All he had to do was take off his glasses and comb his hair back with his hands. Who doesn't wish they could do that?
Izandra replied to El Oso:
Ha, this reminds me of my friend's reaction when Aizen was revealed, had to wipe the drool off her face.
phoenixphire24 replied to Izandra:
Indeed. Too bad I also completely hate him. He may be at the top of my list of "fictional bad guys" that I despise. When they aired the arc about the Vizard's past (Shinji being my favorite character) I nearly threw something at my computer. Why does he have to be so evilly hot? And having just caught up with the scans of the manga, the trick he just pulled also makes me want to throw things. Bastard!!!
Kaitune said:
According to the Bleach anime's latest arc (which features tons of sword spirits for the first time in the entire series. I heard that Kubo did the character designs himself), Urahara isn't the only dude with a female sword spirit. Then again, sometimes I don't feel like considering Bleach anime fillers canon either...
I didn't think about Isshin at first, but I agree that he is the most intriguing character in the entire show. Not like he or anybody in the list has to do anything to be more interesting than Ichigo though. Bleach used to have great fights (that know when to end) and a lot of great character interaction. Now it is just endless fight and stupid Super-Saiya-power-up.
Izandra said:
Gave up watching the anime (although I did come back briefly for the flashback Vizard arc, which was goodtimes), but I still read the manga just so I can see what's going on. Usually I despise spoilers, but I'm just excited Kyouraku's going to do his bankai. He's my favorite.
beltorchika replied to Izandra:
Dragonball was better than Bleach, come on. At least the first 16 volumes.
Izandra replied to beltorchika:
Er... I never said anything about DB. I haven't seen any of it, nor have any wish to, and therefore cannot say if it is better or worse than Bleach.
Anonymous replied to Izandra:
sorry, i responded to the wrong post, my bad
Don East said:
As a Bleach fan, my curiosity was piqued so I clicked and surprise, surprise. Like the series now, it's all Soul Reapers/Shinigami. Yamamoto? More interesting than Ichigo & Orihime? Really? That guy is a senile old fart who couldn't lead ants to a picnic!
I'm a IchiHime shipper so there might be some bias towards this list and its creator but I remember the days when my Bleach OTP had character. But that went away as soon as the series went to be more like DBZ. Why do Shonen Jump series do that anyway? What's so goddamn important about DBZ that it needs to be duplicated? Why not try to be like Fist of the North Star or Kinnikuman. You know, shonens that are actually good.
Wait, what the hell was I talking about? Oh right, I don't like this list.
Adam VM said:
Aizen? Aizen is the perfect counterpart to Ichigo. Ichigo is the dull invincible hero, Aizen is the boring invincible villain.
Even he looks like he couldn't give a shit about the story. His minions die? "whatever." People want to attack him? "Whatever." Just smirks and relies on being the most supremely overpowered fuckoff of a villain in history to get by. The story has made it plain, in fact, that he didn't even need subordinates, he just created/recruited them all for the fucking lulz. He could have just walked into soul society any time and cleaned house.
Ichigo's boring ass will of course beat him, but only because his powerful Sword of Main Character will be strong enough, as usual...
Man, I didn't know I disliked bleach till just now!
Adam E. replied to Adam VM:
The worst part about Aizen not needing subordinates at all is that it made the last ten or so fights a total waste of our time. What was the point of the captains fighting the Espada for thirty chapters if Aizen was going to crush everyone in three chapters?
Anonymous said:
I have one this to say in response to this:
BLEACH SUCKS.
All in favor say "aye".
Anonymous replied to Anonymous:
Also: proofreading
^one thing
Geoff said:
I liked watching Bleach for the first 20 episodes or so, but then it tailed off as it devolved into horrible long-term storytelling featuring increasingly more powerful enemies being offed by the increasingly more godlike main character in episode-long fight scenes. BORING.
When I did a bit of checking and found out just how freaking LONG this was likely to go on for, I'm glad I gave it up when I did.
Kurono K said:
Bleach....
Ahahaahahahahahaha
Yes, Ichigo sucks.
JB said:
GRIMMJOW SHOULD BE NUMBER ONE!!(fanboy mode)
kryonik said:
To all the haters, Bleach isn't the greatest thing ever, but it's entertaining if you don't try to break it down too deeply. Also read the manga, don't watch the anime.
Captain Spadge said:
I remember watching "Bleach" for a while. Then I realised how bad anime can be and moved on. That said, Zaraki is pretty much the best character I've seen in that anime. He's just having so much fun being an epic badass. EPIC BADASS!
lokifire said:
There's only one thing that bugs me about Aizen: It's that he didn't make sure that damned annoying Momo was dead.
Either he's careless or he's actually got a scintilla of sympathy for her. Which is more than I have. Maybe someone should make a list of Bleach characters who are MORE boring than Ichigo.
Volcanic said:
Good list, I like Bleach a lot but then again I am a sucker for Shonen action series, but I'm surprised Unohanana didn't make it onto the list. Although we know almost nothing about her every Captian including Shunsui seems to be terrified of making her mad.
Other then that good list even if some people HATE it it's nice that on a site that is supposed to cater to all nerds mention anime in a context that isn't filled with floating panties or the subject of pedobestial Fan fiction Friday entries.
'Stater Nuts said:
Bleach sucks.
Megiddo said:
I bet you could make a "100 One Piece Characters Far More Interesting Than Ichigo" list.
C'mon Rob, we know you watch One Piece (or at least read it). Why not promote it a bit on the blog? ;)
FreshPrinceOfDeathMetal replied to Megiddo:
Why do you some of you assume that Rob writes every article here? Take a closer look.
Megiddo replied to FreshPrinceOfDeathMetal:
Writing the article in question has nothing to do with approving it to be published on the blog.
I think you just jumped to the wrong conclusion.
G-Fresh said:
lol bleach
Greg said:
Personally I enjoy watching my fabric softener way more than Bleach.
Adam E. said:
Since when was Orihime Ichigo's love interest? That implies that Ichigo is remotely interested in her, which he isn't in the slightest.
Anyway, this list is so-so. I can readily agree with about half of the selections, like Urahara and Yoruichi, but what the hell is Yamamoto doing there? Unohana is far more awesome as far as captains go, and so is Soifon. Rukia is great, too, and a much better character than her stereotypical step-brother. In general, this list was a big sausage-fest, which is a shame. Well, I won't disagree that the protagonist, Ichigo, has become dull.
Victor Delacroix said:
How far into Bleach is the writer of this list? It can't be very far if this is what he truly thinks.
Adam E. replied to Victor Delacroix:
He obviously is very far into it as he references events that happened a chapter or two ago. Question is, how closely did you read his explanations?
Scortia said:
I like Isshin as #1. We got a taste of his backstory and have been in the dark for years now. That's the sort of character that can peak your interest.
Now I refuse to acknowledge Grimmjow because anyone or anything affiliated with the Hueco Mundo arc needs to die in a fire. Bleach could have done such great things after the Soul Society arc but instead for years now it's been fight after pointless fight full of deus ex machina bullshit, power ups, and no plot whatsoever. Despite being shounen, it still needs to have something beyond the damn fights.
Tite Kubo should stick to fashion design and leave writing storylines to good shounen series like Eyeshield 21 and Hunter x Hunter.
Cocacolaoso said:
Someone said in this website, Bleach was the Heroes of manga. And it nailed 100%. The manga lost his mojo after the Soul Society arc. Then it just got repetitive and boring. And TOO many characters introduced without many explanations who they were or what they were doing. Just recently started to look interesting again with the promised, looooong waited Ichigo vs Aizen fight. Can Bleach bounce back to its former glory?
And I think you are being to much generous with Tite Kubo: he is a great character designer but cool looking "mysterious, enigmatic" character is a Kubo trademark and the only character trait he knows, it seems.
Lurker said:
I just like how Orihime has the potential to be the most powerful character in the entire series. She essentially has god-level potential since she can reject time and space to either restore objects out of nothing or erase things from existence itself. It would be like if Haruhi Suzumiya actually had control of her own ability.
The only problem of course is that anyone with a strong enough reiatsu can probably break through Orihime's little barrier of reality hackery.
Anyway, the series Darker Than Black is really the Heroes of anime, not Bleach. Bleach is to Yu Yu Hakusho as is Naruto is to Dragon Ball.
Furthermore, Alive: The Final Evolution > both Bleach and Darker Than Black.
Arc replied to Lurker:
Orihime's powers are directly linked to her emotions. Just like Haruhi's childishness prevents her from grasping the extent of her capabilities, Orihime's emotional turmoil and insecurities prevent her from doing more than falling into the stereotypical White Mage role.
But I find Orihime's powers to be dangerous and slightly creepy.
Hatsune said:
To the people who keep commenting "omg BLEACH sucks" and to the troll named Karma: Go comment on articles that interest you positively and let the BLEACH fans alone. Thank you.
Gintoki Moki replied to Hatsune:
THIS IS A FREE CYBERSPACE!
toplessnerd said:
this article is epic win, i agree with the entire thing. My favorite characters (because of their baddassness are kyouraku, kisuke, and isshin, and you got them all. You are amazing Rob.
Death&Rebirth said:
Well, i don't know the fuss about bleach, since it falls in the same routine as all the other shounen series (Naruto, Dragon Ball, Saint Seya, etc.) of losing, powering up, winning, losing to a more powerful foe, powering up, winning, etc. The problem relies always in same issue of the power balance goes bizarre after a couple of arcs.
Mind you, i use to like Bleach (when it started), i found the SS arc predicable but still amusing (even so just only to see the cpt and vice-cpts in action). The minute they created those 3 new chars (the ones that also were kept in plushies most of the time), in the anime, for that stupid filler arc of "Soul Vampires" and the begining of the espadas arc (with another stupid powering up training for ichigo), in the manga, i lost completely interest. Ichigo was an ok character, as ok can be in these type of series, but the transformation, from stereotypical bad-ass that actually it's a good student to Guy that gives a fuck for the people around him care it's utter idiotic. Alas, this is shounen, it's bound to happen (in some way or another).
Anyway, the list it's ok. Still, most of the characters in bleach are more interesting than Ichigo and Orihime (even, Kon, ffs).
Laura said:
Dude! That Karma guy needs to chill. His/her bad vibes are going to catch up with him/her one of these days. Ironic.
I keep watching the Anime hoping it won't continue to spiral downward. I do the same with books; I feel compelled to continue reading even if I'm not enjoying it, just so I can say I finish what I start. That's one of the reasons I'm very reluctant to start a series, book or TV.
That's not to say that Bleach doesn't have some great points, the first season rocked, but you could probably distill everything else into one more season and leave the rest on the cutting room floor.
I'm frankly disappointed with where the writing went. It had so much potential as an ensemble cast. Most of the characters are cardboard cut-outs.
I started watching Naruto about the same time I started Bleach, and it's been interesting to watch the different directions each has headed. I used to think Bleach would end up being the better series, but since Shippuden started, Naruto has rocketed into well told arcs, while Bleach is in a holding pattern.
I still think the Captain Commander is Ichigo's Grandpa. I'll watch until that theory is proven or disproven.
Keiko said:
Ooooh... shoulda had Yachiru... You coulda just thrown her in with Kenpachi, no one would notice since shes always with him anyway. They compliment each other! Lol, anyway. This was awesome.
seasix said:
Come on man, leave Orihime alone. She's the Pure-hearted Real Ultimate Power Generator of the series, every single shounen or shoujo has one of those in some shape or form. Yes, she gets annoying but she's not completely useless and is important to the story. You'd act hopelessly retarded too if your crush got a hole blown through his chest and then turned into a ugly ass monster that ripped up your other friends.
Riptor said:
The lack of Chad is disturbing because he is the Best Bleach character.
The only better character is Chad standing a mirror thus making it look like there are two Chads
Dr.PennyHorrible replied to Riptor:
WIN.
I, too, was disappointed by the lack of Chad (and to a slightly lesser extent, Uryu) on this list.
Mount_Prion said:
Byakuya is like a vastly simplified Yukio Mishima character.
Ubiq said:
I have two issues with this list.
1) Finding a Bleach character more interesting than Ichigo basically requires naming any Bleach character besides Ichigo.
2) How can this list omit gleeful bastard Mayuri Kurotsuchi while including Sosuke Aizen?
Atellix said:
I'm rather surprised Unohana isn't on this list.
Gleeman said:
No Rukia? I question the validity of this list.
Gintoki Moki said:
Booooooo. Isshin is ranked #1??? He sucks asssss. Aizen rulezzzzz. Actually no, he doesn't. He suxorz too.
Moonshine said:
Notwithstanding the valid and logical arguments put forth by many readers about her behaviour, Orihime is actually more interesting than Ichigo and therefore should make the list.
Now that we're done bitching about this list, how about 10 mangas far more interesting than Bleach?
cruzer said:
I love Bleach, yo. And Ichigo's my homie. I didn't spend too much time on each of the comments, but that's because I took speed reading classes. I saw crazy behaviour and the use of stinky danky expletives!!!!! EWWWWW!!!!
darrell said:
This was a bad idea for a list because (as many above pointed out) literally every other character in Bleach is more interesting than Ichigo. Bleach may not be the best anime out there (okay, it definitely isn't), but it is a great handling of an ensemble cast story, or at least it used to be. I do agree that it needs to be put out of its misery soon. Or it should have branched off into spinoff titles focused on the more interesting characters long ago instead of trying to contain everything under one title.
I see Bleach as being a lot like Buffy. I don't watch Buffy for Buffy, she's terrible and annoying and makes me want to grind my teeth to dust. The other characters make it worthwhile and watchable. But in the end neither is high art or truly great storytelling, they're just entertaining.
wotness replied to darrell:
I totally agree with the Buffy comment. At first I thought she was okay, but I changed my mind later on. Almost every other character were more fun to watch then Buffy. Also what they did to Spike and the Buffy bot and such..why? Then again, I disagree with a lot of "s/he's so awesome" fans of the show.
Kal-El Summers said:
Aizen making the list made me laugh. Dude's one of the worst shounen villians ever along with Pein/Nagato and Sauske Failchia.
Robozen replied to Kal-El Summers:
I have mixed feelings about your opinion there. Pein/Nagato + Sasuke Failchiha > Sousuke Aizen. Ichigo is a joke, but even so I have to take a stand and say, hell Ichigo is more interesting than Aizen.
I think Tite was trying to play the mysterious card around his bad guy, but he failed miserably. Instead of being interesting, Aizen becomes boring. I don't mean no disrespect but he is just like this standaround gigolo whom no one wants to touch because he's got a venereal disease which the virgin Ichigo could neutralize or something. Amirite.
We need a "10 villains more interesting than Sousuke Aizen" list.
wotness said:
My favorite Bleach characters have not made the list, but they are not really the poster image for the word "interesting" anyway.
I don't really agree with the list. The top 4 probably interests me the least. Urahara for his I-know-all schtick combined with the "mysterious air". The last part, Kubo Tite can fail at. It can work for a while, but soon I just stopped being impressed by what should have been a enigmatic character.
Isshin being a former reaper and knowing Urahara and Ishida's dad kinda made me go, bleh. It might answer a few things, but it is not a good plot twist and added nothing of interest.
Bleach is a sterotypical shounen serie. So the character will usually not be all the great either.
Bleach has a number of problems. From the shounen power-ups, that a lot of people around Ichigo develop a spiritual sense and even powers, just because he was not able to close his spiritual tap, Orihime, powerhouses who wait and watch while others fall, etc.
Like most posters here, I liked the Soul Society Arc. It had nice pacing, it was fresh and fun. There were bad parts like how Ichigo would learn something that take years (Bankai) in a week or so. Typical shounen power-up. And his bankai was something of a fail as well: he became fast. But not fast enough to stay ahead of opponents throughout the entire Bleach run. Bankai fail.
It's too bad that tournament/power-up shounen don't learn from some other fiction works, where characters should learn to deal with what s/he has been given. Learn how to use it to their advantage without power-ups. Emma Frost managed to beat a wielder from the Phoenix Force pure on being skilled with the power she had.
That is a example that you can have heroes/villains who don't have a godmode (like the Phoenix kind of is) or get power-ups, try use what they do have to defeat the opponent. Not working? Then get help ;)
Devilmark said:
Kurosaki Ichigo always wins...always wins. That's an interesting concept. But not entirely true. He lost in his first encounter with Grimmjow. He lost his first encounter with Ulquiorra in Los Noches as well. He didn't beat Kenpachi when he fought him either...that fight was a tie. He lost to Byakuya without even seeing it coming. Nnoitra almost killed him after his second fight with Grimmjow.
He also lost to Aizen when Aizen was going after Rukia. Granted, on the last 2 I mentioned he was exhausted from a previous fight, but he still lost. Life goes on, whether you're tired or not. If an enemy appears, and beats you without a problem when you're tired, that's not a fault of theirs, but a fault of yours.
And Ichigo was never beyond one dimensional. He's always been easy to figure out. No matter what. I think some people just become jaded because they want to see him change or something. Well...what you see is what you get, with Ichigo. He's being honest about who he is, unlike his father. That's why his father is so much more interesting...everyone's seen Ichigo, and what he can do. We've only seen Isshin, and what he can do, once, and it wasn't EVERYTHING he could do.
There's no mystery left because Ichigo is the main star...same with Chad, Ishida, Orihime..we've SEEN what they can do. All of what they can do. They aren't as exciting now that we know everything about them. There are still other characters we don't...which brings more excitement to it. Nothing's changed...it's stayed the same from the get. Fast paced, action packed, and a lot of comedy. You're simply jaded because you've seen everything else already, and you think it's time for a change...well, you aren't the one making it. Make your own if you're so dire for change in a story.
TMNT, He-Man, Transformers...they were all basically the same. But we were all younger when we watched those, it was ALWAYS exciting, or so we thought. Go back now, it's nostalgic, but you kind of scratch your head and go, "It's not quite as exciting as I remember..." You still love it, but you can't figure out why it doesn't feel quite the same as it did when you were a kid. Granted, I will admit Bleach dropped the ball with the Bounto arc...bleh. It DID have one of the best whoopee cushion gags I've ever seen though.
At least this has a main character, and you can define him. Look at some of the crap American cartoon makers put on TV now...you want to talk no personality...Judas. So chill, people. It didn't "drop off"...it didn't "start to suck", you just realized that the story isn't going to change at your whim. I still watch it as much as I can, and I still love it. I even start over sometimes, from the very start and work my way up again. I like it more every time too.
rickicker replied to Devilmark:
once more, people: Ding. LEVEL UP! Fanfare. "OH HAY! lookit what i can do NAO!"
that is all. >:3
varrior said:
I like Bleach rather a lot and still follow the manga very closely but I concede that it has problems. It's falling into what I call the "DBZ trap" - finding new and more creative ways to power up and losing touch with the reality of the series. But all the same I love it. I love the insanity and I love a lot of the characters. I think the writing quality isn't as good as it has been since the Soul Society Arc, but that is a REALLY hard one to top, to be honest.
Summersnow said:
This list lost me at "his love interest Orihime".
WillMasters said:
Good, because if i saw Hitsugaya on here, i would have blown a motherfucking gasket.
Miyuki_Abarai said:
First off, where is Renji? I think he deserves at least 6th place or higher on this list. He grew up in a town that was such a slum that it was even called "Hanging Dog," but he still managed to rise through the ranks of the Shinigami Academy, become a lieutenant, and kick Ichigo's @$$ to get Rukia back in the Soul Society. Plus, love the tattoos. You've gotta be pretty tough to get tattoos on your chest and face every time you beat someone's @$$.
Second off...
Okay, I don't have another point.
Carry on.
IamMAN said:
renji is a fucking pussy with a bankai. he get's beat up almost as much as chad
Anonymous said:
Grimmjow Jaegerjaqu- How the HELL do you pronounce this!?
LaughingHands said:
I don't like Byakuya being so high on the list. He's certainly more interesting than Ichigo, but I wouldn't have placed him in the top 10.
I think Chad should be on the top 10. His fighting stinks, but his character is deep.
Nami Chan said:
Wahhhhhhh! Toshiro San is waaaaaaaaaay more interesting than ALL the characters in Bleach!! =(
Fingerprint replied to Nami Chan:
Juushiro all the way. -peace sign-
BoredAsHell said:
wow, this site is just a huge downer! i mean it is sooo depresing! for me, i actually like ichigo and bleach but i'll agree that ichigo's personality has been lowered in quality after the S.S arc but ichigo doesn't suck that damn bad. and for all those people who get all defensive when someone doesn't agree with them, well i just have one thing to say: calm the fuck down cuz u guys get way to emotional over a cartoon!
dogma12 replied to BoredAsHell:
yea
dogma12 said:
i agree
Justin said:
Oh god. They put the emo Byakuya at 4. Shunsui is by far number 2 on this list. No one knows his Bankai, he rarely talks, he's a badass! I like Urahara at 3 more that 2. I also know someone has said this before but Yamamoto has probably seen Aizen's shikkai causing him to be useless in a fight with him.
raven232 said:
actually i think this list has much more characters to add but till now am ok with it.
