Beginning on this August 31st, DC is semi-kinda-sorta rebooting their entire comics universe by launching and/or relaunching 52 new comics, all beginning with #1. Some characters are changing drastically, many aren't. Some things are getting switched around, some major developments are being forgotten or moved past, some costumes are getting altered, and some of these things are staying totally the same.
Suffice to say, this "DCnU" move has pissed off a lot of longtime DC fans, and certainly, Topless Robot has been bitching about it just as much as anyone. But while DC could be probably be doing some things better, really, nobody knows anything for sure about how good or bad the DCnU will end up being, for the titles in specific or even DC in general.
So DC is shaking things up. Fine. Good, even. DC's books weren't selling as well as they could be and a relaunch can bring some new life into a tired industry; it's why Marvel and DC do them all the time. And you know what? We've survived all of them. In fact, here's 11 reasons why the DC relaunch probably won't open a pit to hell and usher in the End Times.
11) Not Everything Is Fucked
Relax. Over the last few weeks, DC has let enough info slip to ease some of our worries. They've admitted that Batman Beyond is relaunching sometime in 2012. Same with Batman Inc. The speculation of Justice Society never coming back was disproved after a couple weeks of people yammering about it. And the Superman/Lois Lane marriage that's coming to an end? A future scene in Superman #714 said that they break up and get back together a few times over their history. So while the instruments may change, the symphony is pretty much the same.
10) DC Is Listening to Their Fans
Let's make it clear here, organizing a protest march at SDCC is the wrong thing to do. It sends the message to people who are trying hard to entertain you that you know their business better than they do. But to DC's credit, they're making changes based on what they're hearing.
Most importantly, the complaints about female creators were heard and incorporated into the business plan. But aside from that, DC is being very open with what they're releasing, in order to prevent panic. Interviews are numerous and full of details. Preview art and sample pages are all over the net. They're answering fan questions in panels, forums, and even in the pages of their comics. Compared to the garbage bags worth of vague teasers and title-only solicits we get on a monthly basis from every comic company under the sun, it's refreshing.
9) New Villain Blood
One of the most noticeable constants in all the new 52 solicits is the amount of new villains coming into the DCU. Everyone's getting some new punching bags. Mister Terrific fights Brainstorm. Hawkman fights Morphicus. Batman fights the Gotham Ripper and someone in an owl mask. The Justice Society, Superman, and Aquaman all have new villains too. Will they suck? Will they have staying power? Remember all the forgettable characters we got back in Bloodlines? (No, not Hitman.) Sometimes the massive wave of new characters isn't a bad thing. But at least it gives writers something else to play with in future stories.
8) Cutting the Dead Wood
Surprise! Not everyone likes every DC comics these days. Some of the books, I hate to admit, aren't chartbusters. Books like Titans and Outsiders and even Justice League have been slogging along for months and I think Green Arrow has spent two years telling only two massively decompressed storylines. So kill 'em all. Start over with books that have a chance of attracting readers. Now there's no need to try to figure out whatever happened in the last three years of Teen Titans angst-fest, it's just starting from square one. Give everyone a break from the oppressive continuity we cling to so hard.
7) You're Still Going to Get Good Stories
Put the fear of continuity loss away for a second. Do you think that the new 52 are going to be mediocre? DC knows these books have to be hits out of the gate, so these aren't fill-in issues we're dealing with. While you might not be a fan of Green Arrow or Mister Terrific as characters, these books are probably going to be above average. I'm buying all 52. Will I hate one or two or several? Probably. But I think that will be more because of my preferences rather than lazy writing and art. Give it a shot, it's just money. You'll get more eventually.
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Suffice to say, this "DCnU" move has pissed off a lot of longtime DC fans, and certainly, Topless Robot has been bitching about it just as much as anyone. But while DC could be probably be doing some things better, really, nobody knows anything for sure about how good or bad the DCnU will end up being, for the titles in specific or even DC in general.
So DC is shaking things up. Fine. Good, even. DC's books weren't selling as well as they could be and a relaunch can bring some new life into a tired industry; it's why Marvel and DC do them all the time. And you know what? We've survived all of them. In fact, here's 11 reasons why the DC relaunch probably won't open a pit to hell and usher in the End Times.
11) Not Everything Is Fucked
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10) DC Is Listening to Their Fans
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9) New Villain Blood
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8) Cutting the Dead Wood
Surprise! Not everyone likes every DC comics these days. Some of the books, I hate to admit, aren't chartbusters. Books like Titans and Outsiders and even Justice League have been slogging along for months and I think Green Arrow has spent two years telling only two massively decompressed storylines. So kill 'em all. Start over with books that have a chance of attracting readers. Now there's no need to try to figure out whatever happened in the last three years of Teen Titans angst-fest, it's just starting from square one. Give everyone a break from the oppressive continuity we cling to so hard.
7) You're Still Going to Get Good Stories
Put the fear of continuity loss away for a second. Do you think that the new 52 are going to be mediocre? DC knows these books have to be hits out of the gate, so these aren't fill-in issues we're dealing with. While you might not be a fan of Green Arrow or Mister Terrific as characters, these books are probably going to be above average. I'm buying all 52. Will I hate one or two or several? Probably. But I think that will be more because of my preferences rather than lazy writing and art. Give it a shot, it's just money. You'll get more eventually.
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I hope this'll give me a chance to get into this stuff without being tangled up in plots...
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I agreed with all points up to number one. I understand what you mean that "continuity doesn't matter", but at the same time it definitely matters. Fans invest themselves in the stories, we follow Batman's adventures through thick and thin so when they pull the nevermind-it-didn't-happen card we get understandably upset.
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There is another reason the DC relaunch might not suck. Finally after years and years of mini series and guest spot appearances, Frankenstein finally gets his own series.
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Comics are better now than when they were in the 90s, Japanese Comics are not flipped anymore, They read right to left as they should. I like the older comics, minus the color. Comics now are pretty much the same, they just have evolved in story, colour and art. The current Wolverine Origins (Nothing to do with the movies) is pretty good, I love X-Men Evolution I wish they continued the comic (With better art) and TV series. I've read the older marvel comics, they are the same as they are now accept I did notice a element in older marvel comics that looks like it inspired some of the goofiness in current japanese comics. LOL, one issue of I think Uncanny X-Men one of the characters lost their clothes in a very comedic manner.
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Nothing, these guys are just a bunch of geeks and nerds that were thinking of positives....I see no red-lights indicating they were paid. I can usually tell.
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I did and I agree with nearly all of it, so there!
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I thought about that as I was typing it. As it turns out, that's why the artist presently known as Frank Quitely uses the name! :)
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I love it when someone says "quite frankly" when talking about Morrison, considering how often he works with Frank Quitely.
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And they paid you how much to post this?
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I really feel that the "panty shield" (and I can't think of any other possible name for it) is a huge mistake. I mean, why not just three arrows pointing to it, for heaven's sake? The boots...y'know, I am the target audience for those, but that just means part of me likes them, and the rest of me feels cheap.
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*backs away slowly* NURSE!
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While I agree with you about telling people to "shut up," I disagree that SC4R3CR0W is "right" (or "wrong"). I just hope his username isn't also his password! :)
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To quote The Dude, "Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man."
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My issue with your comment is that it states your opinion as fact. Quite frankly, I liked the majority of Grant Morrison's work, especially his "Doom Patrol" and "Animal Man" where he posed serious questions about not just comic-book superheroism, but humanity and reality in general. No creator is perfect all the time, and no creator makes things that absolutely everyone likes. Yes, some people will find some or all of his work a bit crap. That's the nature of culture. We could all like the same things, but that would be such a bloody bore.
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Y'know, if Krypto turns out to be a stuffed dog, I will read the Hell out of the new Superman.
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It is all irrelvant. Neither Marvel nor DC has published anything worth reading since 1987. Morrison and Claremont ended the era or comics and begot the era of soap operas. Heroes turned to insecure fools, mundanes became totally stupid .. just like real life If I want real life I'll stand in Times Square or LA at 2am and watch the bleeding. We need a collector with money to buy both of them, take them private, and return to storytelling the way it should be done.Do yourselves a favor - collect 1937 to 1987 and forgo the trash.
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Knew it wouldn't be long before someone trotted out the "you're too stupid to understand" defence.
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"C'mon! Animal Man is the Reese's Peanut Butter Cup of comics - you can't not like him." Then how come SNL's Seth Meyers (@sethmeyers21) gets HIS head on Animal Man's body. ::jealous::
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Continuity is kryptonite for casual readers! I grew up watching the Superfriends cartoons and the Superman movies; I like superheroes (DC/Marvel/whatever) but I can´t really get into all the obscure and endless references in all this comic book series. There are so many mentions of pseudo-scientific concepts, imaginary places, alternative times that the story just don´t make sense, it´s like it´s written in another language. I have read some classic graphic novels like Kingdom Come, Killing Joke, Arkham Asylum, etc...
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^No I understand perfectly his stories & no it's not always that clever...
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Are you insane? Morrison is one of he best wrirs, that industry has nowadays. All-Star Supermanwill be for a long remembered as the best Supermn story ever told. His Batman run is one o the smartet nd multileveled cmic book runs ever. Just because you are not smart enough, to understand his work, doesnt mean hes bad writer.
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Valid points, perhaps the relauches would leave room for new characters. Though they may not have said it, they may even decide to bring Static Shock back since Marvel has a black bi-racial Spiderman coming. There an interesting fact, Static was originally for Marvel and supposed to be African American Spiderman, but not with spider powers.....Strange how when the creator of Static died, they exposed an half African Amercan Spiderman.
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Two quiet musings: One. This is what happens in a universe without death: everything stagnates. In a universe where death is irreversible, old ideas die and new ideas blossom, and you don't have to worry about old ideas repressing new ideas because, well, the dude doing the repressing is dead. Such is not true with the comic book universe, where death can be easily reverted with the flick of a pen, and thus ideas became stale. Two Good writing > Reset button. Writing is not easy, yes, we get it. But as Nerd Hitler pointed out, when the Flash has a kid, you don't hit the reset button, Geoff. You write that shit out and see where it goes. Write GOOD, mind you. You were paid for it, after all! It's your job, responsibility, and pride as a writer to do it properly. And if not, then to hell with you! Find a new job!
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Johns , while in my hack list nowadays , did great stuff back in the day. I loved his Flash & he created Zoom (Hunter Zolomon) one of my top 5 flash villains. Bendis however is a hack & I really was pissed for what he did to the avengers & Carnage
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Young Justice was a team I followed nigh religiously! it had FUCKING IMPULSE! & Fuck Didiot for what he did to that team... frikkin shitty silverage fetishist...
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For the Bankrupty of Marvel , complain about Bob Harras who was indeed a schmuck. As for Nicieza & Lobdell & Louise Simonson , well they did something Claremont did not, making me love the X-men; then Morrison & the big fat Q undid that love. As for Liefeld, honestly I found Linkara's criticism fun but BY NOW I'll say that Rob gets TOO MUCH flack , TOO FUCKING MUCH ! Srsly, Liefeld is harmless when you get down to it, not good but a really harmless kind of mediocre / As for the writers you cited , I perfectly agree the 90's DCU is my DCU & honestly I would not want it otherwise
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don't tell people you disagree with to shut up. it's unpleasant & rude. & he was right Darkseid vs Batman should not even happen , Bats would be a pile of dust if he fought Darkseid directly
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sir , we are on the same boat here, & Morrison is NOT the god of all comics or whatever, he's just a writer with hits or misses... Mostly misses with me now let's take a look HITS: - JLA & One Million: the peak in Morrison's career at DC, with JLA's Rock of Ages being Final Crisis done right, and One Million being a great cosmic-level DCU crossover . -Animal Man: This is where Grant really proved that, if you know what you're doing and don't give a flying frack about it, you can take a D-List character and turn him into at the very least a B-Plus List character. He damn near turned Buddy Baker into an A-Lister -All Star Superman: Silly yeah, but an enjoyable kind of silly that worked on its own silveragish little world, read it , liked it but not the definitive take on Supes for me (that'd be the Bruce Timm version...) MISSES or let's say FUCK UPS because these REALLY PISSED ME OFF! -Fantastic Four: 1234 he fabricated and introduced elements into the team members individual personas that simply could not have existed previously and the FF still be able to function as a team for all those years. Had he been allowed to go with what he'd originally planned - revealing Sue had incestuous thoughts towards Johnny, his career would have been torpedoed right then and there, along with whoever at Marvel allowed it to happen.Oh & Doom lets Sue scold him like a kid without reacting? FUCK THAT! DOOM shall smack the harlot! _Batman ; let me keep this short , Damian Wayne. Yep, I still hate the little dipshit & still wish the Joker would give him the crowbar treatment, honestly does it make any sense that Batman would accept somebody in his home with open arms after this person has beaten half-to-death his (adopted) son and assaulted his long time friend? Even more ludicrous is that he accepts Talia Al Ghul's word that the boy is theirs without doing a DNA test once they are in the Batcave. Did I forget to mention that the boy brings back a head he decapitated back to the cave? Does Batman approve of murder all of a sudden? His treatment of the Joker was pretty lame & as a fan of the Clown Prince of Crime I basically said fuck it!Thats not the Joker in Morrisons run, its a compilation of the most overused serial killer cliches coupled with Sweeney Todd and all rolled up into a turd that is supposed to be justified by Morrisons "super sanity" retard logic. - New X-men: most people in topless robot know my opinion about this wretched run...I was so fed up with the deterioration of the team and its mythologies that it took just Decimation to give justification for dropping the book & writing MY own Continuity or fanarts. Decimation was the HEADSHOT, but the rest of the haybale had been immolated & raped by Morrison long beforehand while he could , with a better editor or a competent co-writer ,have done wonders. Before you tell me it was great, think again...he was only doing the X-Men for the money and didn't care about the characters or the fans. Ok it sucks but he was honest. The biggest problem I had wasn't the continuity issues, or the failing plotlines. Its the failed human beings he replaced them with. Some of my favorite x-men were Scott Summers, Jean Grey, Bobby Drake, Henry McCoy,Gambit, Rogue Bishop, Logan,Sabretooth, Emma Frost, Magneto, most assuredly Mister Sinister, the Juggernaut , Apocalypse , Stryfe , Cable, Deadpool, the X-force & Generation X kids & the X-factor crew. Where are they all now? They are almost wholesale pathetic remains of the characters from the 80's and 90's. My favourite get jobbed instead of having their ideologies explored & given the epicness they deserve Scott Summers, Jean Grey, and Emma Frost are without need for me to explain how TERRIBLY these characters have been handled not only in terms of the direction they've taken but in terms of their personal integrity, these 3 now are particularly bad off, and two of them bring me a deep sense of disgust & I gotta thank both Morrison & the Big Fat Q for fucking them up beyond any repair ( it's OMD level of FUBAR , guys . No recovery in the "mainstream"!) http://devilkais.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d3k8map -Final Crisis: Superman saves the day by singing a SONG. I...kid...you...not.... as a fan of Darkseid, I find it really sad how horribly villains of great magnitude get shat on over & over while the cartoon gets the villains RIGHT & RESPECTFULLY entertains you. Srsly , the 2 last episodes of JLU is what it should have been. I only gave my honest opinion about the titles I read from him .
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Maybe it's just me. I think it looks cool. I've been wanting an excuse to read DC Comics for quite a while now. Marvel just makes me angry. I'm a Marvel fan but all I have to do is say 'Spider-man' and I think that would explain what I'm so mad about for so many fans. DC actually seems to be writing-focused. They actually seem to care if the stories make any sense or if Batman seems like Batman. I'm sure Superman will be more youthful, but I bet his un-marriage retcon won't feature a bunch of humougous false promises and end with the worst comic of all time. It wil be 'He just not married anymore. Lois will still be around. Etc.' I've read some Green Lantern in the last couple years. Great stuff. I want to read this. I think this stuff will be great.
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I have to disagree. Continuity does matter, and I've slowly been dropping my DC titles over the year. Since everything features the same characters, all the background character have more or less been shit on constantly. I initially got back into DC with Green Arrow/Black Canary, then Booster Gold , and POwer Girl when I saw Amanda Connor was doing the art. And they managed to - over the course of two years - make me cancel each book. Things didn't mesh with the current DC storylines, and nothing made sense. It was a mess. So, I'm sticking to Marvel.
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I like the last point. IMHO, continuity hasn't been a DC (or Marvel) priority for a decade, at least. The two companies are constantly contradicting previous stories... and I love it! I want to read good comics and the comic universes are too convoluted to allow good stories to be written if attention is paid to all the details. Superman/Batman is one of the only consistently well written comics, period, because it concentrates on good stories instead of on continuity. Barbara Gordon as Batgirl again? I love it!
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Wow--any time that someone tries to ram THAT many bad ideas down my throat in a single article and orders me not to complain of it, I KNOW this crud DC Comics is dishing out has got to be way worse than I'd ever imagined. DC Comics is not some magnanimous clan of gods who is doing us the favor of entertaining us: We PAY them for the privilege. They were so kind as to kill off my favorite characters, so I'm returning the favor by not buying their books. My wallet is enjoying the change. ("wallet" "change"--get it)? Hey, that's more entertaining than DC books have been in years...
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The Nerd Rage is out of control!
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How much is DC paying you?
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But bitching pointlessly is so much more fun than keeping things in perspective!
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But bitching pointlessly is so much more fun than having perspective!
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I read the last issue of Batgirl, and thought how all this must suck for her. Not only is she being replaced by the original Batgirl, but she has no logical place in the new continuity. She's the second replacement for a female knock-off sidekick. She went from being raised by a super villain, to being a costumed vigilante, to being Robin, to being dead, and then she was Batgirl. Try fitting that into the time-compressed reboot.
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Wait...what?
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Batman using a gun to kill Darkseid proved that Morrison understands Batman perfectly. Final Crisis is unjustly vilified: it's a great series. And the Batman of Zur-En-Arrh was awesome.
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I disagree with this list. 11) Just because books are re-launching latter doesn't mean there not fucked with, my guess is they all will have different shit going on now because of the new DC. 10.) DC's not listening to all their fans. I am a fan I have e-mailed DC many times. I don't care about a female or male creators ( If a stories good who cares if it's written by a dick or vagina.) Also, I have read where most fans (including me) would have preferred if the had to do a reboot to do a full reboot over this soft boot bullshit there currently doing. But DC didn't listen. 9.) I'm not a fan of new villains for the sake of new villains. I like my old/current villains just fine. 8.) I think the current Batman and Green Lantern books are dead wood, horrible written stories. DC isn't getting rid of them. And I also liked Titans, JLA, and Teen Titans. And I'm pretty sure someone out there liked the current Outsider's as well. 7.) Your still gonna get bad stories too. 6.) This is in the eye of the reader. I'm not a Jim Lee or Geoff Johns fan. JLA will not be a good book to me, like it seems it will be for you. 5.) Who gives a shit? I was fine with them separated. 4.) Why not just keep the old ideas then, and try for something new? 3.) No, but they have caused sales to drop when they are radically changed. 2.) I have no clue who Jeff Lemire is besides he wrote Superboy, and why I should care that he's writing Animal Man. Animal Man is a great character when done right. However, just by looking at the covers, which is all we can look at right now. Animal Man looks to be the worse fucking thing in the new DC. Also, read Animal man after Morrison left it got preachy. 1.) No it doesn't, but it shouldn't matter that it's there ether. I like continuity. When I read something I like that it ties into something I may have read 2 years ago. To me it makes for better stories than the story just being there. I know way disrespect your opinion that you made with this list, I just like I said disagree with it.
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My only question is this: When Animal Man walks into a room, does everyone hear "MANIMAL!" and a panther roar?
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Morrison is only at his best when it's his own material, or if it's a minor C-level character that has no backstory, and he can craft said character to his image. When he's working of fully-fleshed out characters or titles with history (X-Men, Batman, and now Superman), he sucks donkey testicles. My apologies to Morrison fans out there, but that's strictly my opinion...and that's what these are, aren't they? Opinions.
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Zur En Arrh Batman was amazing, and Grant gave us Joker knows he's Bruce confirmation. Shut up.
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Never read any of his DC stuff, but Morrison's run on X-Men is one of my favouritest things ever. A pox upon all who hate them. A POX!
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Gee, by the same logic? I guess All Star Batman and The Dark Knight Strikes Again are good as well, because Frank Miller once wrote some good stuff back in the 80's The Grant Morrison of today gave fans Final Crisis... which sucked and sucked hard; and The Batman of Zur-En-Arrh... which ranks up there with the Spider-Clone saga as far as ludicrous and franchise crippling storylines go. He deserves to be vilified, if for nothing else, than by making Batman use a gun to murder Darkseid, proving he has zero clue of what makes Batman, Batman. Morrison = overrated
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If there is still an Oracle, then DC are hypocrites. I think it was Didio, but I'm not sure, who said that the decision to make Babs Batgirl again was made because Oracle had moved Batman away from being a detective. The argument was that with Oracle present, Batman would hit a problem and just ask her for the answer rather than finding it himself.
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For me, Agent X was one of her good runs, even though Marvel tried to mess it up. Wonder Woman and Birds of Prey were weak. Wonder Woman was so bad that it brought down Secret Six when she guest starred in their book. But that is why I say Simone is hit and miss. Just because you like one of her titles doesn't mean you will like all of them, even if they all get plenty of internet praise. Even inside a title she can be off. While I think Secret Six is one of the better books DC has (or had, as it is now over), the Wonder Woman crossover was painful. Black Alice, who I believe was created by Simone, is a terribly designed character with one of those overpowered vague Swiss Army knife powers. And the wrap up to the series is a bust in my mind, with Simone apparently writing a reset to years of development for multiple characters. (I haven't finished the last issue, so maybe she does something interesting, but the previous issues were looking pretty bad.)
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When DC updated their logo, I thought they should have used the Superman/Batman logo instead.
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The cape was still a blanket in the Silver and Bronze age. Only difference, is he isn't wearing his blanket as a onesie.
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The Justice Society works if you put them on Earth 2 again, but tweak that planet to be more like Earth 3, where WWII never really ended. Make the Justice Society members 18 years old in the 1970s or 1980s fighting nazis and unrest at home. Then at least they wouldn't be 100 years old in 2011. Then you can have Infinity Inc. and the new JSA roll out. DC also has to make a specific policy regarding passage of time, and fire anyone who doesn't adhere to it. Make one year real time equal one month comic time, for instance. Then after 12 years our favorite heros have only aged a year. Also, guys like Hawkman and Aquaman should be so much more popular than they are. A reboot finally helps Aquaman shed the pussy image that the general public has about him.
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Justice League, Action Comics, Batman, Aquaman, and Green Lantern will make the top ten. So, DC will have the top ten split. It's even possible that Detective Comics and Superman break the top ten. So 5, possibly 7 books in the top ten. Which is what DC has been doing for years now. Wonder Woman, the Flash, Justice League Dark, Teen Titans, Batgirl, Supergirl, Green Arrow, and Fury of Firestorm will crack the top 25. So out of the top 25 books, DC will likely split that with Marvel. Which is what DC has been doing for years now. Birds of Prey, Batman & Robin, Dark Knight, Red Gaurdians, New Guardians, Outlaws, Hawk & Dove, Superboy, etc. will crack the top 50. So, DC will have anywhere from 35 - 50 percent of the top 50. Which is what DC has been doing for years now. Not sure why DC is rebooting their universe, since a Johns/Reis Aquaman would sell no matter what. Ditto a Snyder/Capullo Batman, a Morrison/Morales Action Comics, etc.
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Don't care. Done reading DC. Need to save money anyway, really.
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I just hope the same can be done for Braniac. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGQEAiZJMco
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Here's the thing: Power Girl is being totally forgotten about. Maybe not Karen Starr, but Power Girl. And that sucks.
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I really think DC hurts itself with overly-strict continuity. Dropping that might help some of the problems mentioned in the comments. New readers, for example. It <I>is</I> hard to pick up an issue when the story refers to dozens of previous incidents, sometimes in different titles. Why not have titles without a history - that is, after every story the situation resets to the status quo? That was more-or-less the Golden Age and Silver Age models (with some accumulation of villains and Bat-Cave trophies). But at the same time, you can have titles that do accumulate a history over years or decades of issue. These would serve the long-term fans who want to watch the characters develop. They might even have to accept the characters can die, or be replaced, or both. There's also no need, as I see it, that titles be consistent with one another. Have a title where Barbara is Batgirl, and one where she's Oracle, <I>and</I> one where Stephanie's Batgirl. Likewise with the Robins, the Lanterns, all the stages of Dick Grayson's career. I suspect this idea might go over well with the talent. They don't have to run every story past a continuity-checker (though some titles might have a "bible" to follow), and they can do what they want to the characters. There would be negatives, of course; there's no way with the available talent and resources to support every title everyone might want. If sales are bad on the "Jay Garrick is The Flash" or "Jason Todd: Nightwing 2" line, it goes away.
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I for one am glad Wonder Woman now has pants. Wonder Woman should have pants.
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Thank you for this. I've been trying to tell my friends the exact same thing, but they won't listen to me; perhaps they'll listen to you! I'm worried too, and maintaining a cautiously optimistic attitude in spite of it, but the b*tching has been pretty melodramatic since the announcement was made. Change happens all the time and as much as nervous as it makes us, we should try to remember that what doesn't change eventually grows stagnant. I certainly have my misgivings, but I'm taking a 'wait and see' attitude about it. There's really no reason to get worked up about something we just don't have all the information on yet. I feel like we're the kid who falls for the "you've got something on your shirt" prank every time and keeps getting a sore nose for it. They've done this before, they'll likely do it again in the future, and maybe we oughta try not looking down for once and keep our eyes on what really matters - that we're still getting good stories. It's likely not all 52 of these titles will survive, but some of them are going to be awesome, and I can't wait to read them.
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Maybe I'm a cynical asshole, but some of these positives I can't help but seeing as turds in a microwave. "Remember how psyched we all were when Jim Lee did X-Men #1? " Yeah, but you don't seem to remember Jim Lee working on and never finishing Morrison's Wildcats or All Star Batman and Robin. "Wildstorm in the DCnU" Great. As if the new timeline and world building wasn't confused enough, now we got all of Wildstorm there. Plus I think trying to fit Wildstorm into the DCU is fitting a square peg into a round hole. "Put the fear of continuity loss away for a second. Do you think that the new 52 are going to be mediocre?" Yes. Yes I do. Already stuff like Daniel's Tec and Finch's Dark Knight. Hell, why are there many damn Batman books?! DC can't freaking focus. So much for trimming the fat! Those books look boring. You know, if they even come out on time. Even Lee and Johns's Justice Leage seem like old hat. I know it will seem new to new readers, but it just sounds pretty standard fare. Meanwhile we get radical changes like Morrison's social activist Supes and outstanding books like Batwoman. So it's a very mixed looking bag. Oh and why the fuck is DC saying it's been five years since the dawn of superheros and Superman came on the scene. Damien is ten years old. I don't care if he was a clone accelerated in a lab, that' still four Robins in five freaking years. Their own rules don't make sense. And how did Dick go from Batman Inc back to being Nightwing?! Well, I guess there's always that final issue of Batman Inc to explain it, but I ain't holding my breath.
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My favorite thing about all this? The Vertigo embargo is, officially, completely and utterly over. Not only does it mean that writers get to play with John Constantine Swampy and Shade and the Endless, but from all the "Dark" titles (which, admittedly, is a horrible name) a-coming and their stellar creative teams, it seems some of that Vertigo sensibility will get to work its way into the NewDCU. Pre-Vertigo books like Sandman, Doom Patrol, and especially Swamp Thing made great, creative use of the DCU, and I can't wait to see stories in the vein of "The Garden of Earthly Delights" again.
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Who organized a protest at SDCC? I just remember hearing about one woman who asked a question and stood her ground and who did not accept a non-answer who happened to be dressed as Batgirl. You're not thinking about her, are you?
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Didn't you see the picture at the top? DC's Reboot is all about how Batman's penis is the grandest of all!
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Clever puns, but where are your reasons? I don't like EVERYTHING Simone's done (Agent X, blerg) but she made me give a crap about Wonder Woman by giving her some awesome, epic-scaled villains to fight.
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Afraid not. http://www.ifanboy.com/content/articles/The_Definitive_Guide_To_The_DC_Comics_Reboot
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It will suck because there is no Secret Six. Best comic out there and it's cancelled. Beautiful.
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And they are changing with the times by using the same people who made successful stories in the 90's! Won't this be something new. Expect pouches.
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I'll give you number 2, but I still think this is the wrong way for DC to rejuvenate comic sales. I don't see any non-comic fans becoming eager to buy comics because of this gimmick. And yeah those redesigns are mostly tragedies... even if they aren't permanent they hurt my head. Ah Jim Lee. Batman Inc. is the thing I want to be killed off the most honestly....and it won't be sadly.
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Yeah . . . and his "apology" and response came via form letter and laundry list of women DC had hired in the past. They can either hire more talented women writers & artists or shut up about this issue, imho. Edit: what's also funny is that DC's 1% woman staff is still larger than Marvel's. And Marvel's just sitting there, grinning, and possibly writing to Uncle Walt Disney for more cash :P
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Damn you DC! The nerds are restless!
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Periods of reboots and artistic advancement have introduced the Silver, Bronze, and Modern Age of Comics. I would like to now welcome the ‘Aluminum Age of Comics!. :þ
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Yeah I know. But it feels good to let it out anyway, ;)
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you do know no one is going to read all of that don't you
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If DC REALLY wanted to bring in new readers to their books like how they say they do I don't think this is the way to do it. The main thing they should focus on is "availability". You know where I buy all my books at? Online. And I pretty much just buy the trades now because of that. I wait a few months for a storyline to end and buy the compilation. Because there is only one place within driving distance from me that even carries comic books now. And that is "Barnes & Nobles".Just one store,thats it! And they're about 30 min away.Plus they don't carry everything. Only a select few monthly titles and the more popluar trades. There are no comic shops around this area any more. Marvel made sure to drive them out of business back when they started up their own distribution service. Remember that? I live in small town Ohio. It's not how it used to be when I was young and you could buy comics at the local grocery stores. Most young kids (i'm gonna say 1 - 8 years old) in my area have probably rarely even seen a comic book before because literally no one around here sells them now. So more than likely they're not going to be interested in them as they get older either because of not having any access to them. I'm assuming it's pretty much like this everywhere other than the bigger cities. I started reading comics when I was very young because I was allowed to buy them at the local grocery store and i've stuck with them into adulthood. If you cut that "availability" out then you're not going to be creating any new customers for yourself. Even with this reboot they're doing it's not going to increase the "avaibility" of their product to bring in new customers. I know they've said they're going to put more of their books online to read but I still don't see that helping any. Plus thats just not the same as holding a book in your hands. If you're already a fan of a book I could see you transitioning from buying it physically to reading it online. But If you're not already into comics I can't see that helping them bring in new readers. Use Japan for example. Reading comics is just a normal every day thing over there. There are titles readily available for all ages pretty much wherever you go. You start buying them when you're a kid and and stay interested in them into adulthood. All because books are easily found there. Thats how you keep new customers/fans coming in. Not so much here. The second part of my complaint/rant has to do with price. It's ridiculous when a single issue of a monthly book is hitting between $3 to $4 or more an issue. The fancy high grade paper is nice and all but i'm willing to do without it for a price cut on the book. If you're an avid reader like how I used to be and you're buying numerous books a month then those prices add up. Once book prices started getting higher I had to start dropping series altogether to stay within spending reason. As previously stated I mostly just buy trades now. Price is a big part of the reason for that.
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im 34 and havent read comics since Cloak and Dagger so for me, this is a Very Good Thing. as in ill pay money for comics.
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See: Entropy
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I'm going to admit that I'm actually looking forward to this relaunch. I missed out on a whole plethora of DC heroes because I didn't feel like researching a dissertation just make sense of anything I read. Plus Superman can wear whatever the hell he likes just as long as he's still saving innocents and putting the hurt on space fiends.
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Obvious troof is obvious.
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{{Lex was president long before the first Batman / Superman arc.}} True, but his presidency ended in that arc. Unless it also ended in a substantially different way in another book...?
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With the exception of Byrne's Superman origin, hopefully. God, I will never understand what people see in that series.
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Of course they are! That's what's so ridiculous about saying, and I quote, <i>"Eventually people will see this and re-read his books and go: 'Wow. These really are crap.' The only good book he ever produced was WE3."</i> People re-read his stuff all the time, and rightfully, it's considered groundbreaking.
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You do know that the Green arrow book that is "probably going to be above average" is written by J.T. Krul, the same guy that wrote the first 13 issue arc Green Arrow series that you ridiculed in number 8, not to mention that he's guy who wrote the god awful Rise of Arsenal?
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Same time Neil Gaiman did Sandman. Late 80s, early 90s.
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I just woke up from a 17 year coma. Forget DC. What happened to Valiant comics?
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When were they written...?
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ZZUUHHHHHRRnnnnnnAAARRHHHHH!!! (Edited to add: that's supposed to be the sound of nerdrage, but might possibly have a double meaning.)
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I would probably hate-fuck Grant Morrison, given the opportunity. I think that encapsulates how I feel about his writing.
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Looks like Batman ran out of bullets there. (Edited to add: not that this is a bad thing. Just had that association flit through my mind when seeing the art.)
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Old and busted: costume sewed from blankets looking reasonably awesome and iconic and even thematically evocative of Moses (via the Jewish roots of the co-creators). New hotness: costume sewed from blankets looking like sewed from blankets, fans raging and/or rofl.
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IS WONDER WOMAN GOING TO WEAR SHORTS, PANTS, OR BOTH? I MUST KNOW!!!
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Breaking the list down: 11) Not Everything Is Fucked Ok. Agreed. PS, I don't care about Lois and Superman in any event. 10) DC Is Listening to Their Fans Bullshit. Or at least, they may be listening but they aren't giving straight answers back. Answers have been random, convoluted, and contridictory, and the ComicCon panels were pretty goofy. 9) New Villain Blood Sure. Why not. Of course, why is a reboot needed for new villains exactly? 8) Cutting the Dead Wood Ok. Of course, one might argue that Leifeld being hired is the EXACT OPPOSITE of cutting dead wood. 7) You're Still Going to Get Good Stories Sure. The whole problem with this reboot is "good stories" is abstracted from the relaunch. We will get some, but the relaunch has nothing to do with good stories. And yes, some will be mediocre (and some awful) out of the gate, just like some of the Flashpoint tieins and new titles were mediocre (and awful). 6) It's Got Some Seriously Good Creative Teams Sure. And some seriously awful ones. 5) WildStorm Is Now in DC Continuity Which will bring some good new blood, and some really awful new blood. Many of Lee's ideas were just dog shit terrible. 4) No One's Gone Forever Oh sute, I think all of us agree that the odds of this sticking for 5 years is roughly nil. 3) New Costumes Never Killed Anyone Of course. That said, if they are shitty they are shitty. Some of the new costumes are shitty. 2) There's a @#$%ing Animal Man Series by Jeff Lemire I put high odds on it not lasting 2 years. I'd love to be proven wrong DC. 1) Continuity Really Doesn't Matter It hasn't mattered much in either company for decades. Good stories matter. Erasing good stories for a marketing ploy is pretty shitty. If we get 52 great titles with good stories, all the better. I have doubts.
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I like to keep my fans on their toes!
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Exactly. This list is a lot of "it will be fine because... because it will be fine" reasoning. If all the books are amazing and great, you're not going to hear (many) people still bitching, although I still maintain that good writers can tell good stories without flushing continuity and starting over. The reason people are complaining is that this whole move doesn't get anyone to believe that the stories will be markedly better after the reboot, and having Lee as one of your major creative innovators puts heavy money to the opposite result. People are complaining because it feels like a cheap, poorly thought through excuse to get people to buy 52 #1 issues... covered in an excuse that the universe is too convoluted and confusing. What is ridiculous is that the same people praise Grant Morrison... a good writer but an AMAZINGLY dense and convoluted storyteller. Morrison has the ability to pull it off, but anyone using the excuse of stories need to be more accessible while praising Morrison's work are completely off their nut. Stories need to be GOOD. Good = accessible.
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I can't tell if you are ironic or serious. Animal Man and Doom Patrol are masterpieces.
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I think an increasing number of people are realizing that collecting anything when the producer is catering to collectors means, surprise, everything is worth jack shit in the end (of course there are exceptions). of course that just means eventually they will lose enough sales that collectible will mean something. but it won't ever swing back to what it used to be. I wonder if the solution is electronic media for people who just want to read the damn things at a good price and paper media for collectors. seems like an everyone wins situation.
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Agreed. Morrison is way over-rated; look at how he butchered the Batman books!
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Great defense of the rape of continuity! You should be on law team of Casey Anthony. But now let's do the reasons it sucks: 9) Mostly destroyed continuity... 8) Overtly suggestive male genitalia... (Unless you're a girl or maybe homosexual?) 7) New costumes? Did you see that Supes outfit with him in denim jeans?! Terrible! 6) Batman and Superman: same tailor much? 5) Will they ever fix Wonder Woman?! 4) Batgirl, changed again. (Also, did they give us any official word on Oracle?) 3) The re-numbering thing, it just bothers me. Can't any issue make it to 1k? I'd be down for 1k plus even. 2) Does anything long time readers were collecting matter anymore? 'No." BUT the good news is, they're going to redo most those stories so you can give them more money for them, AGAIN... 1) New villains equal bigger lame rogue galleries for lesser characters! Move over Weather Wizard, Blue Snowman just stepped up in this bitch!
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y'know, anyone looking back on old comment sections is going to be very confused. :)
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While it's nice to see someone jumping in front of the bullets fired at DC lately, I'm only voicing my pleasure because all my hate and rage need more people to consume with regard to this topic. The more, the merrier. Put as pretty face on it as you want, I'm still gonna punch it because DC was already getting MY money and now the stuff I wanted is on hold or totally erased because they wanted to try something new. It's House of M all over again. Fuck that shit.
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Yes, it does encourage you to look at her crotch, and anyone with any design education should realize that, so it pretty much has to be intentional (there are two, three counting her emblem, big triangles all pointing right to her crotch. Are we going be getting Super-Camel Toes and they want to make sure we notice their "gift?"). I'm fine with the cape, really, might actually have a good reason to wrap like that (to stay on securely when running around to compensate for a fastening method that allows it to rip away if grabbed?), but my question is, "where the hell are her pants!? I thought the women were all being given pants in the DCNU...
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Does anyone have a link or source where I can get an answer to this?
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Yeah, his Doom Patrol and Animal Man are clearly viewed as two of comics' biggest mistakes. NO ONE reads those anymore.
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